E348 | “We’re going to replace our own business with AI”: Aytekin Tank on Scaling to 700 Employees & 35M+ Users

0:00:00 – Speaker 1
We are going to replace our own business with AI. We are not going to let someone else come in and replace it for us. We are going to disrupt our own business. How can we make it so that you don’t have to use a phone? You could just talk to an AI and fill out the form? So when we released this product to small number of chat forums, we saw that people actually liked it. People started using it like crazy and we were really happy about that. You know, hey, wow, people are using it, it’s good and. But after a while then we actually looked at how people use the product. We discovered something. Hello, I’m Aytekin Tank. I’m the founder and CEO of JotForm. Jotform is an online form builder that I started two decades ago and it’s about forms, but we host like over 30 million forms for, you know, 35 million users. So we are a pretty big company now with over 700 employees and offices all around the world. I have three kids and I live in Ankara, turkey.

0:01:12 – Speaker 2
And just in case people haven’t come across Jotform, we were talking before. You don’t say what your revenue is, but to give somebody a sense of scale, you’ve got how many employees? 700. So most people listening will just be able to do some mental maths and come up with their own number for revenue. But you, in terms of scale, are you the largest supplier of forms like that? Because I mean, I’ve filled in job forms. You know people have sent me job forms to fill in for all sorts of stuff. But you know there are other people, like you know I don’t know Trueform and other people who do forms. Google, you know, in terms of, in terms of the market, are you number one?

0:01:56 – Speaker 1
Google Forms is bigger than us. So, in terms of like, like, when I look at like, when I look at Google Trends, like Google Forms is bigger, microsoft Forms is pretty big, but after that, like we are the market leader, like, if you don’t consider them as like, they’re kind of like they’re part of their like, you know their drive, google Drive but in terms of actual products that stand on its own, we are actually the top, the market leader, and we actually grow faster than other products.

0:02:33 – Speaker 2
Yeah, you’re number one where people have to pay with their own dollars.

0:02:37 – Speaker 1
Yeah, exactly yes.

0:02:40 – Speaker 2
So you know you’ve been at this for two decades. Why, why? Where are you now? So that’s like 2005. Where were you why? Why did you decide in 2005 to make this your life’s work? What were you doing before this?

0:02:56 – Speaker 1
Yeah, I said I studied computer science and then, when I graduated, one of my and this is like 2000. So my dream was to work for an internet company and I started working for this media company in New York and I worked there for five years and I learned a lot. But there was this ambition about building my own product. So it was like I really wanted to create a product, share it with the world, get other people to use it, and previously, even when I was student, I released some open source products. So I had this ambition about like building my own product.

And while I was working for this media company, like we had like over 100 websites and I was like helping a lot of editors and they kept asking me for forms. Like they were asking me for like contact forms, payment forms, questionnaires, like they were running you know events and they were running different, you know competitions, contests. So, and I was actually looking for a product Like I didn’t want to create them manually. I was looking for a product like I didn’t want to create them manually. I was looking for a product that could actually help me. Uh, just, you know, just use that product. But I couldn’t find one. Uh, it is a good one and I knew that this would be a good product to start.

So I had that pain, uh, while working five years for the media company, and that pain actually uh kind of gave me the inspiration to start a forms business, even though it was early days, it was slow. It was so slow that during the first five years of JAT form, like first year, it was all me and then I had my first employee. At the end of the first year I had my second employee, like first five years, like we were growing like one person at a time. Like at the end of the 50 year, like we were, you know, I had like five employees. It was such a slow growth because there wasn’t a big market, but over these two decades, like online forms has grown a lot and especially during the pandemic, we have seen a huge bump in the transition to the online forms from previous ways of, you know, collecting information what?

0:05:08 – Speaker 2
what drove? I mean people were not in their office, but like what was the business shift that drove that growth during the pandemic then?

0:05:17 – Speaker 1
I think it’s it’s. You know, like I remember before the pandemic, I remember like people were sending me, like uh, documents to sign and I would actually sign them, I would fax them or I would scan them. But after the pandemic that kind of stopped. People actually started using products like DocuSign. The same way, when people needed to collect information, they would just give other people like here’s a form, here’s a paper form, fill it out by hand, right, uh, or they would just collect the information, like by face-to-face communication. But now also, people actually moved, uh, working from home, and that meant that that meant that, like you know, it’s just it it was so hard to like print stuff you know, most people didn’t have the printers at home like just uh, it was so much pain. Similar, similar way to like docu. So how docuSign has grown huge in a huge way, or zoom has grown uh during that time. Uh, online phones have also grown, uh in a huge way fab and so market leader, you did proportionally well.

0:06:27 – Speaker 2
Exponential shift, and where has the market gone since Covid?

0:06:32 – Speaker 1
then the growth has had continued. So the I think the online forms are still growing because in many times, like even people who don’t use like digital, like paper forms, they kind of discovered that they can actually do things much, uh, streamline their work, uh, they can automate their work by just using forms. Because when you use a form, it’s not just about filling out the form but, um, what do you do with that information? Like, do you pass that information to like a crM or a spreadsheet? Like, what do you do with that information? So we kind of we didn’t stop at forms, right. Right, we consider forms as the first step in the journey. And what’s the rest of the journey? What’s the next steps people take when they actually fill out the forms, or the business or the organization does with that information? So we kind of like we have this user research team with interviews our customers constantly, every day, and then we learn from them, like, we discover, like, what did they do after they fill out the forms? And from all that knowledge we actually created all these additional products. Like we have an e-signature product called jotform sign. We have an app builder product called jotform apps. Uh, we have an e-signature product called JotForm Sign. We have an app builder product called JotForm Apps. We have our own spreadsheet like Airtable, like spreadsheet product called JotForm Tables.

So we kind of created all the other additional things like workflows and things like that, or document generation like PDF creation from the data from the forms. So we built all those things to be able to like help people from the data, from the forms. So we built all those things, uh, to be able to like help people with the rest of the journey once they receive the data, like do they need to send it to another another service, right, because people also started using many sales products right in the past, people would actually handle everything manually, they would use a spreadsheet. But today people are actually using all these many SaaS products For a CRM. Maybe they are using Salesforce or HubSpot, maybe they’re using all these different products and they expect these products to actually be able to send data to each other. And once you are able to send the data, actual online forms become much more useful because you automate so many things you previously do manually. I think that’s the next part of the growth actually coming from that, like the integration and streamlining the operations of businesses.

0:09:05 – Speaker 2
And what are some of the top use cases in that automation that you’ve enabled?

0:09:10 – Speaker 1
We are seeing like I think there are like four different types of users that actually use JotForm a lot. The first one is like small businesses. Like small businesses, they have to handle like so many things. Small businesses, they have to handle so many things. And when you’re trying to handle so many things, it’s just getting information one by one or getting if someone makes a request, you wanna streamline that request. You wanna actually ask the correct questions on your forms. You wanna validate the data so you save time. Every time when you’re making an offer to some client, you wanna make sure that you receive the data correctly. So the forms are helpful in that way.

The other three is about if you are actually dealing with auto people. And the other three are healthcare, education and nonprofits. With healthcare, like, you have all these patients, doctors and other people. And with education, you have the students, teachers, parents. So many people are involved, so many requests are being made, so many processes that need to be streamlined. With forms and with nonprofits, they’re also dealing with lots of people. They’re trying to get information and organize lots of people. So those three organizations are actually also using forms a lot. But we see online forms being used on every kind of organization, every kind of industry. But if you are dealing with a lot of people, if you need to get data from people, if people need to, you know, submit some information, make a request, register for something, those kind of things. You, when you use online forms, you you can actually take advantage of the automation and save so much time and so the automation.

0:11:04 – Speaker 2
Are you doing that on your own platform or are you going and using someone like Zapier to do the automation?

0:11:12 – Speaker 1
We actually have native integration as well, but we also have, like you know, zapier or Make. We also have integration with that, but for, like, the most common type of integrations we actually we have like our own native. Sometimes we even have our native applications. Like we have a Salesforce app. That’s actually, you know, that works from Salesforce own platform as well. Right, but yeah, we try to do as much as possible with connected as many services as possible. Okay.

0:11:45 – Speaker 2
That’s fab. And where? Where do you see your? Where do you see that going now with AI and automation that might spring off the back of a Gentic AI, now that everybody’s got agents and browsers and so the the funny story, uh, um, like two and a half years ago, like early 2023, I actually released a book about automation uh, automate your busy work.

0:12:11 – Speaker 1
Uh, the thing is, I wrote that book before this ai craze, so it wasn’t really about how to automate your busy work with ai, but it was more about like the automation principles and how to basically, you know, take your business and automate things, uh, gradually and as much as possible. Uh, and, like, what do you need to do? Um, all the things that I learned from like talking to all these just from users. But when I released the book, I was actually on this book tour, virtual book tour, mostly like podcasts, and every time I go to a podcast, they’re asking about, like AI right, this is just AI is suddenly, chet Chepichi recently came out, so everybody’s talking about AI. Like it’s crazy, and I was kind of left behind at that point. Like we were actually like doing hack weeks. We are trying to learn what all this, you know open AI stuff and just playing with it, but we never had like this, you know something real with that. And then, after like, answering so many questions about AI, I learned so much about AI Because I had to answer all these podcast hosts about AI and like, while I was like researching about it, I discovered, okay, we are left behind, like we have to do something about ai. I started thinking like, okay, maybe my own business are going to be replaced with ai, because, if you think about it like, uh, why do you want to fill out this boring form when you could just talk to this ai and then you know the AI could take information right, if the AI could do everything, why would you use a form? Yeah, so we decided with this idea that, okay, we are going to replace our own business with AI. You know, we are not going to let someone else come in and replace it for us. We are going to actually disrupt our own business. Like, how can we make it so that you so that you don’t have to use a form you could just talk to an AI and fill out the form?

We started the AI journey two years ago with this idea in mind and then we built the first version in JotForm fashion. We don’t just build stuff, build stuff, build stuff and release it. We will just quickly build an MVP minimum viable product and we will release it to a MVP Minimum Viable Product and we will release it to small number of JotForm users. So when we released this product to small number of JotForm users, we saw that people actually liked it. People started using it like crazy and we were really happy about that. Like you know, hey, wow, people are using it, it’s good.

But after a while then we actually looked at how people use the product. We discovered something People weren’t using it the way we envisioned it. People weren’t using it so that their users could fill out forms by just having a conversation with AI. They were actually like, in addition to form building, the AI could go to a website and then talk to a chatbot and fill out the form by just answering questions. Or you could talk to an AI over voice and answer questions and the AI would fill out the form for you. But in addition to this, we actually built something else. We actually allowed the AI to be able to have a knowledge base, answer questions you questions, be this customer service person as well and what we discovered was like 10 out of 9 weren’t actually using it for forms. They were actually using it for customer service. They were doing customer service with our product and this wasn’t something we expected.

So, just like we were only like three months away from releasing JotForm AI Agents that we discovered that, okay, we were only like three months away from, you know, releasing JotForm AI agents that we discovered that, okay, we are actually like, you know, we are positioning this product incorrectly. This is a customer service product. And then we were like curious, because there are like so many customer service products like there is the agent force, salesforce has agent force, intercom has, um, you know, finn right, uh, but what we discovered was some of these products were too expensive and some of these products weren’t very good and they weren’t really they didn’t work well, so people would. Actually they discovered that jot forms ai is just this beta product. They discovered it was both not very expensive but also did a great job at doing customer service, so they were using a lot.

So early this year we released just from AI agents and it’s it’s been growing as a customer service product and we have like over 15,000 organizations are using it for their own customer service and we are seeing like over 10,000 conversations daily between AI and you know their customers or you know 10,000 conversations daily and we have been working on it and we have been adding additional channels as well, so it’s not just on your website that answers questions or on the phone answering questions, but you could actually put it on your Instagram so it can actually answer DMs. You could actually put it on your Gmail so it can actually learn from your previous answers and then answer new incoming emails, just creating drafts for you so that you can read the drafts and send it to them. So we kind of like from forms. We actually moved to a secondary and new kind of market this way, because people actually took us to this path. They actually needed this product and we gave it to them and it’s going pretty well.

0:17:43 – Speaker 2
I was on your website playing with your demo agents this morning and I thought they were pretty good. They weren’t laggy. Obviously, the demo agents have got a limited amount of knowledge base underneath them, so when you ask them what they can do, it’s not a lot because it’s just uh, it’s just a demo, but the interaction I had with them was, uh, was very good. And what have you done? If you have you, then are you connecting just the knowledge base or are you using, like chat, gpt or anthropic or something like that as well, to as well as the customer’s knowledge base? How are you, how are you powering them?

0:18:19 – Speaker 1
yeah, we are definitely using uh existing models, uh in the backhand, like we are using both open ai, chichi, bt, uh we are also using like cloud and um gemini. So, you know, depending on like we are basically like, we build it in a way that it can actually work with all these different uh models. But, uh, depending on the performance, we will actually switch them between different models, because there’s this big race between all these models and then you will see one day, like gemini is doing really well and then open ai will actually pass them. You know they will release a new version. So because of that, you know we are just measuring the success of each uh, each model, and then which model is more successful, we will actually switch to that one.

And even on on our enterprise uh version, you could actually use your own uh. You know the open ai account or or something like that as well. But in our regular version there is no confusion. It’s just you know, you just create an agent, you give information, you can connect it with your, you know the product that you, for example, you could connect it with your Google Calendar or Calendly and if you want your AI agent to be able to like do appointments for you. It can actually do that because it knows your calendar, it knows all the you know or Calendly, it knows your open spaces and then when people ask for, like you know, for an appointment, it can actually set up everything for you and you will just see this appointment in your calendar, Fab, and so where which of are you yourselves using your own agents?

Oh, yeah, definitely.

0:20:11 – Speaker 2
And which ones have had which ones have had the. I suppose they’ve got two things. One, two. I suppose maybe there’s three right In terms of stakeholder impact. Right, which ones had the biggest impact on your customers? Uh, which ones had the biggest impact on your customers? Which ones had the biggest impact on your employees? And have you been able to reduce your recruitment requirements as a result of deploying any of your agents?

0:20:34 – Speaker 1
so before we released the job from ai just to our own, you know, average response time for our humans were over like one hour, so it will take like an hour to get back to you when you make a request, right?

0:20:50 – Speaker 2
When somebody submits a ticket.

0:20:52 – Speaker 1
Yeah, yeah.

So we have over 100 support employees who are answering all these support tickets, right, and we get thousands of questions every day.

But when we actually released the, we didn’t actually replace it with our human support, but we also added this chatbots on our most common, most high traffic pages on our product places like that. So what happened was because people could get instant answers, that our support team actually received less questions, and the easy questions people actually got their answers instantly from AI, so it was a win-win. And the tougher questions they would go to human support and ask to it. So we actually started receiving more support questions because there was AI. Right, many people like when they think that, okay, it’s going to take an hour for them to get back to me, they will not ask a question, maybe they will find the answer for themselves or maybe they will just leave the product. But when there is an ai, people actually, uh, like they were in, like you know there was no um, you know they, they could just ask something quickly, right, uh, to a chatbot and that actually made a big difference.

So we I believe like we had like two over two thousand uh like conversations daily with our uh customer service agents and our um and people were actually getting results. And one of the things we did was our support team. Like we actually moved like over 10 people from support team to to a review team and what they would do is like they they would actually, instead of answering questions, they would actually read the conversations between AI and customers and then they would actually review them and they would mark them as results and, in addition to that, if there was any bugs, any problems, this actually helped us improve our AI agents product as well. And in the early days problems, this actually helped us improve our AI agents product as well. And in the early days, the resolution rate for the AI was around like 25%. It was very low. Three out of four actually couldn’t get the answer. They would go to the human.

But over the three months that we kept improving it and we discovered problems with our own product, we fixed those problems, like the usage of knowledge base.

When the knowledge base grows, it’s hard to make sure that the AI can actually find the right information in your knowledge base to be able to answer the questions.

To make that easier, you use additional products. So we actually improved the way we use those products and over time, from 25 percent in three months we actually increased that to 75 percent. So, instead of one out of four, we were getting results. We were getting three out of four results and only a quarter of the questions were not resolved and they were usually going to human support. So that actually helped us improve the product, improve the, our customer service, because what we discovered was our actually because our ai agents were actually using our own user guides and we discovered that our user guys were actually missing like so much information. So we also improved our user guides and the AI agents learned from those improved user guides to be able to answer in a better way. So over time they got better and people were able to get their answers quickly. So and for our support team, it’s not about like maybe they receive less questions.

But the thing is we are able to deploy them in places where they’re kind of managing the AI. They are managing the AI, they are improving the knowledge base, they are reviewing the AI conversations, because now we have more conversations happening with AI. Now we have more support people to review these conversations. But the quality of our support has probably doubled because of this, because now our human support is also able to answer questions much quickly. Like that one and a half hour response time actually went down to like half an hour. So if someone actually, you know, sends a request to a human support, now they are able to get back to within half an hour and they are able to get much better answers.

And we weren’t able to deploy our live agents, but now we are actually also do live chat support. But, for example, you are having a conversation with ai, you say I want to talk to a human and then our human human agents can actually instantly, uh like, talk to you because they don’t have lots of workloads and they are able to do live chat as well. So in the I think it’s win-win for everyone and our support team. We still need them because they are kind of reviewing all the AI conversations and providing us the feedback and that’s also important and our customers they get instant support and they get a higher quality support. So I think it’s win-win-win for everyone.

0:26:18 – Speaker 2
I think it’s interesting because you know, if I take you back to before, you had the chatbot, the AI agent, you know the knowledge to improve your knowledge base was probably in your ticketing system, but everybody’s so busy nobody has time to fix it. And then you bring in that sort of pattern, interrupt and you go. Actually this creates just enough buffer for us to put some people onto this, and then you get that sort of upward spiral of quality and so, whatever the knowledge base is that your internal people are using, it’s got better too. The consistency of your ticketing’s got better. The job’s got less difficult. The consistency of your ticketing’s got better. The jobs got less difficult for all of your existing agents.

0:26:58 – Speaker 1
As your have you seen, your employee satisfaction scores go up, as well as your customer sat scores go up around support uh, I haven’t actually checked that part, uh, but uh, when I talked to the um, our, you know employees, they’re really excited about it Because it’s like answering the same dumb questions again and again. It’s kind of boring Now, all those easy questions. They’re answered by AI and all day much more. They can actually take more time to answer more complex problems and find better solutions. So, instead of trying to fix as many tickets as possible, now they’re able to take more time and that’s why they enjoy their work more At this day.

0:27:44 – Speaker 2
That’s what they told me Very good, and I guess you’ve now got now, because you’ve launched a whole lot of new products. You’ve been able to launch those additional products without hiring more people. So you haven’t you haven’t got rid of anybody. Everything’s got better. Redeploy fab. Your agents have got better because you’ve changed the underlying knowledge base. What else has got better about the agents in the time since you’ve launched them? What else have you? What else have you changed in the product and what are you thinking the future looks like for these agents?

0:28:16 – Speaker 1
you? You mean the human agent or the ai agent?

0:28:18 – Speaker 2
no, no I mean, I mean the ai agent right, because I have this it feels as though chat it’s like chat gpt launched and then and that was amazing like it did some tricks, and then, maybe four or five months ago, uh, there was another inflection, which was? Which was? It seems as though that’s bigger than the original. You know, now that you can now that agentic, now that there’s, you know, uh, browser mcp, you know there’s a whole load of stuff that, like 12 months ago you couldn’t do at all, and now there’s a whole different toolkit that that we’ve got to play with.

0:28:53 – Speaker 1
I think there are two different dimensions where we are actually improving the product. One of the dimensions is the number of channels that you can provide support to your customers. Last month, in August, we released our Instagram agent, which means over Instagram instagram, you can actually automatically like your ai, can answer your agent can answer uh questions to your um, to your dms, or even like to your comments. Previous month, we released the gmail agent, which means uh, and the gmail agents was like one of the biggest successes because it’s so easy to use. All you have to do is, like give access to our ai agent, uh, to your gmail, and it will just go read your previous emails, learn from them, create a knowledge base, create it, you know, prepare for its answers and whenever you receive an email, if it’s not like spam or anything, if if it’s an actual customer, it will actually create a draft for you. And we are actually checking what percentage of users are actually sending those drafts without much changes or just changing them a lot. And we are seeing most of the people are just sending those drafts as it is and some people just make minor changes or just rewrite it. But, um, it looks like it’s just saving people so much time because if you’re providing support over email, now you’re able to, like, when you, when you receive an email uh, the ai agents is pretty fast so that, like, as soon as you receive it, in a couple of minutes you have the draft draft. So when you go to your Gmail, when you see incoming emails, you also see the drafts and then, if you need to change them, you change them and send it, or if you just send it as it is. So save so much time.

So we released a presentation agent. You know, put it on your website. People can watch presentations and ask questions to the presenter. The presenter is also an ai agent, so it’s actually showing all these slides, talking, but if you ask a question, it will also answer, answer you, it will wait and answer. So we are adding all these additional channels and we have more channels coming in the next months. So one dimension like providing as many different channels as possible to provide customer service, because once you train your AI agents, you want to be able to use it as much as possible in every place you are answering questions.

The second one is the tool usage, and you mentioned that. Right, I gave the example of how the AI agents can take appointments for you, because they can integrate with your Google Calendar. They can also integrate with your Salesforce, for example, and then be able to use that information from there. Jotform forms are integrated. That was the initial idea. They can actually fill out forms for you when they’re told, when someone is actually talking to your ai agent and reporting a problem, it can actually fill out a form for you and with the proper questions that you want answered, with the proper, proper drop down, selected, all the things that you need, and then it can actually submit that form for that user. By just having a conversation with that user, I think you know these things.

0:32:15 – Speaker 2
it it’s the number of times somebody sends me a form and they know who I am and then I have to type in the information again that they obviously already have about me and so that whole you know, the AI knows who I am, so I don’t have to tell it my name and my address and my date of birth, because you already know that and that’s struck. Then taking that structured data and then doing, you know, doing that automation or the integration that you already have in place, that’s just, that’s just fab exactly.

0:32:43 – Speaker 1
Uh, we, we had that even before AI that you could actually uh when you fill another form. Uh, it can actually use the same data, but with AI it’s just, uh, much easier. As you said, like it can actually use the same data, but with AI it’s just much easier. As you said, like it can actually remember you. If you’ve talked to a chatbot on on on the website, when you come back, it can remember you and then, if you are filling out the form, it’s gonna remember your name, all the information that needs to be filled out.

0:33:10 – Speaker 2
Yeah, what’s the preai agent? Was it mostly web and and therefore, and then desktop, or was it mostly mobile and, as the ai agent shifted you more into mobile than than historically?

0:33:26 – Speaker 1
that has always been like 50 50. Uh, the desktop and mobile is always like equally important. I don’t think it has changed With the mobile. What we have is like we actually like people who has forms. They can actually create apps as well mobile apps easily and share it with their customers. And that’s useful because in the mobile app you can log in. It can remember your information If you’re submitting the form multiple times. It can actually remember those information. So JotForm apps is useful for that as well. But in terms of filling out forms, we are seeing both. It kind of depends on the use case. Many people still use desktop as well, because this is mostly like a B2B product.

0:34:12 – Speaker 2
Okay, and just something that when you said the enterprises could use their own, is that when you talk about the enterprise product and they could use their own licensing, is that just like they’re paying their own tokens, so they can use their tokens instead of paying you for the tokens?

0:34:28 – Speaker 1
I think the biggest reason people use enterprise is there are two big reasons. You could use your own domain name, right, for example, you know, if you want to have like formsshallcom or something like that, you could have your own forms app. And the second one is you could have this admin panel where you can add people from your company. Like you know, many people within your organization can use this product and they can reuse things, for example, within the company. For example, when you create a form, it has the logo already on it, things like that. So basically, the enterprise version is more about like team usage, a lot of like collaboration features and also, you know, security is also important, especially on a larger companies, and the regular user is more about. You know, security is also important, especially in larger companies, and the regular user is more about, like you know, individual user. It’s still a business, but you’re just a single user who is creating forms this AI stuff?

0:35:34 – Speaker 2
Do you think about AI as fundamental as electricity or the next industrial age and it’s going to decimate jobs? Or do you see it as a sort of a platform shift and things change, but not massively? What do you think?

0:35:59 – Speaker 1
During my lifetime I’ve seen like this, this, four revolutions I’ve experienced, and it’s very amazing amazing technological revolutions. The first one is like the PC, right, personal computer. I was a kid in 80s, like I don’t remember much, but like just before that people would use, like typewriters, pen and paper, right. And then, after that, people actually became much more productive. They started using, like you know, word or Excel, spreadsheets, word processing computers, right, it made them so much productive and so, you know, you don’t want to even go back to the old ways, right, it’s just made a huge difference for businesses especially. And then the second revolution was the internet. It’s 1990s I remember it more, right, I was in college and and I created a website like it connected people, like the internet actually connected people. In the early days there wasn’t that much, like you know, e-commerce or, like you know, sas businesses, but people were connected by email and the internet, right. And then the mobile revolution right, that’s like in 2000s, everyone walking around with a computer in their pockets. And I think this is the fourth one, uh, because I think it’s pretty big, uh, as as big as the other ones, because this time, uh, you have all those advantages of, you know the personal computers, uh, internet, because this computer, they are connected to each other and mobile. You have it everywhere, right, chpd app? I have it everywhere. I have a question. I just talked to it and asked my question. Uh, you can search anything, you can research anything and it’s it’s already like growing, like just, and people, like the adoption is huge, like hundreds of millions of people are using chetchypt every single day.

And now, if you have a business right, your customers are also expecting that from you. Because, as a consumer, your customers are using Chechipiti to ask like general questions like you know, when is that game, when is the match? But they’re also asking about, like, what time is this business going to open Things like that? Or they just want to be able to talk to the AI of that business. Business going to open things like that? Or they just want to be able to talk to the AI of that business.

That’s why I feel like this AI agents for customer experience is so big, because every business, every organization could have their own AI talking to their customers and they could just in the middle of the night, you could talk to a business. You cannot talk to their human representative, but you can talk to their business. You know they can’t, you cannot talk to their human representative, but you can talk to their ai. You can ask all kinds of questions. You can even buy the products. I mean, you can buy it now, but you you can actually do everything you need, like if it’s a service business, right, you can provide information, get an offer, you know, pay for it, whatever you need to do. So there’s just just so much potential with AI, so that’s why I think it’s huge.

0:39:06 – Speaker 2
Fab and the title of your book Automate your Busy Work yes, so get a hold of a copy of that and that will help people get some time back. What other books along the way have you read that have had an impact on you?

0:39:26 – Speaker 1
The book that inspired me most was called Creative Selection. It’s about Apple in the early days of Apple and this person who actually built the keyboard for iPhone that you know that virtual keyboard and he actually created the first version of Safari browser and he actually describes how Apple works and how you know he worked with Steve Jobs and how the you know the organization worked and I learned so much from that and applied that you know information worked and I learned so much from that and applied that, uh, you know information, that those experiences to my business and use my in my business. So that’s that was great inspiration for me. So, uh, that’s creative selection is great.

Um, the second one is the goal. The goal, uh, it’s a, it’s a book about theory of constraints and it’s about how to discover bottlenecks and how to use those bottlenecks to improve your business. And that was really inspiration for me, because in my business I’ve seen this again and again there’s usually like one big bottleneck and you don’t actually see it, usually like maybe you are aware of it, you know, but you’re not really uh kind of you. You assume that it cannot be fixed or something. But if you, if you actually, if you sit down and like, just okay, what’s my biggest bottleneck, what’s my like, what do I need to fix in my business? And like, if you are really candid with yourself and if, if you can discover that, that then you can actually solve that bottleneck, and if you have that idea that there’s always this big bottleneck, that you need to discover it, you actually find that bottleneck. So, uh, that’s why I love that book.

And uh, the third book that I’m going to recommend is called no man’s land, and this book is about how, like you know, some companies are. They’re usually stuck in this, like this. They’re not really small, you know, smaller than like 10 million dollars or something like that, but they are usually stuck there and they cannot scale from there. And this happens a lot. Like most companies are actually stuck there and they, they stop, their growth actually stalls and this. This is actually like you giving all these points about what you need to fix, what do you need to look for to be able to unstuck yourself from there.

Like you know, there are like many things that that and I I read that book a lot and that actually helped me scale my business, because usually, like, when I read that, okay, this is actually where I’m stuck, like I need to improve this. Like one of them is management right. If, if you don’t have a good management, nothing you do really works like you just have to fix the management. Otherwise, everything you do, you do it half like you don’t do a good job in the execution. So so you fix the management right. So there are many amps in that book, but it’s a great book. It’s called no Man’s Lead by Doug Totum Fantastic yeah.

0:42:33 – Speaker 2
Aytekin, that has been absolutely fantastic. What a great insight into, well, your business and the success you’ve had, but also the the, the current implications of ai and ai agents. So I’m going to go and have a look at your presentation agent. I can see that I could see that I could use that and the email one as well. I think that, um, certainly from client perspective. Uh, I’ve got clients who that would just be transformative for them. So thank you very much indeed. Thank you, dom.